The subject of conversion is up again on the blogsphare. Within the Messianic Jewish camp they put a high degree of importance to conversion. They seem to think that ethnicity can be changed with one cut. If this were the situation, then millions of Arabs would be Jews today.....
I know, I know, some of you would say: " Hey, Dan, circumcision is not the only component of conversion, there is acceptance of the Mizvot, immerssion, and acceptance of God's sovereignty." You are right of course, so let's imagine what would have happened if Ruth the Moavite would have requested to attain Israeli citizenship, where conversion-Giyur- is a political football for decades now.
Taken from an article by Reuven Hammer in the Jerusalem post 6/1/2009:
"...Please show us your conversion certificat. What rabbinical court issued it? What Jewish community does it represent? No beit din? So who converted you? Where did you study and what? Was the program a year long, and did it consist of at least 360 hours? No course at all? You said something about "your people, my people, your God my God" and that was it? What is this, a joke? Did you remain in the Moave Jewish community for a year afterwards? No? You say you had a Jewish husband-OK- but he is dead so that does not give you any rights. No, mothers-in-law don't count. Look, it is pretty obvious that you are simply one of those foreign workers looking for a job in agriculture that pays better than what you could earn in Moav. That is exactly what we're afraid of. Back to Moav with you.
So much for David and the Messiah! Obviously at the time of the writing of the book of Ruth, conversion as we know it did not exist-although later interpretations sought to read it into the book. See, for example, Yevamot 47b. The Torah envisions non-Israelites living in the land and after a period of generations some of them could become part of "the community of the Lord" (Deut. 23:4). The book of Ruth seems to posit this happening immediately when a person actively desire it. During and after the Second Temple period Jewish law gradually CREATED conversion as we know it, with a formal ceremony before the court."
So there you have it. And since in Israel Orthodox Judaism has control (see Agudat Harabbanim decision from 1997 where they decided that Reform, and Conservative are out of the sphare of Judaism), I don't think that Derek Leman's conversion is worth the paper it was written on.
Another point that Hummer says just put me in stitches...
" "After all, fancifully and anachronistically our tradition has even read conversion much further back than Ruth in our history. It asserts that Abraham and Sarah led conversion classes. He taught men, she the women. (Genesis Rabba 39:5)."
Can you hear him Gene Shlomovich? This guy is a Jew, and he is not One-Law....
They seem to think that ethnicity can be changed with one cut. If this were the situation, then millions of Arabs would be Jews today
ReplyDeleteNow that is really funny! Thanks for the good belly-laugh.
Whats the advantage behind conversion? I mean, if there is a pathway to salvation without conversion, I just don't see the point. And, as I see from your post, it seems like a difficult thing to be seen as "legit" I guess. Seems like a lot of trouble to go thru ya know?
ReplyDelete@Mike, I think you'd have to talk to someone who has converted to Judaism or is seriously considering the act to get your answer. Those people who I know who have converted have done so because they have a Jewish spouse and felt a strong conviction to have a united Jewish family (which I can appreciate, since my wife is Jewish and I'm not).
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure what other reasons a person would have to convert unless they felt a strong conviction that the only or the best way to have a relationship with God was as a member of His chosen people. Even in traditional, rabbinic Judaism, you don't have to be a Jew to have a relationship with God. The Noahide Laws are present as the lifestyle for Gentiles in that context. In the Christian/Messianic world, we know that Yeshua is accessible to the Jew and Gentile alike.
I've said on my own blog that, while I've entertained the thought of conversion from time to time, it seems that if God wanted me to be a Jew, I'd have been born a Jew. To convert would be like saying that God made a mistake in making me a Gentile. Since God can't make mistakes, where do I get the right to "override" God's decision?
I can't disdain the reasons and convictions other people may experience that leads them to convert. Certainly, if a person is married to a Jewish spouse, wants to have a Jewish marriage and raise children in a Jewish home, then I can see the justification, but for me, it would be like throwing away the sacrifice of Yeshua and pretending to be a person other than the one God made me to be.
Why would this even be considered?
ReplyDelete1 Cor 7:17... each one should retain the place in life that the Lord assigned to him and to which God has called him. This is the rule I lay down in all the churches. 18 Was a man already circumcised when he was called? He should not become uncircumcised. Was a man uncircumcised when he was called? He should not be circumcised.